Indians For Guns

hi friends,
Today i saw a berreta .380 with my friend.although my brother owns a berreta in .32 but i had never seen one in .380. he took me along to a gunshop as he wanted to buy the cleaning kit ,and wanted to have a look at some shoulder hostlers etc. there the gunshop owner after looking at the weapon game me some pearls of wisdom here are them as follows

1. the effective stopping power reduces because the barrel lenth is short.

2 the range is also reduced greatly because of this factor.

3 not very wise to buy a pistol which have the same frames and barrel lenths as in .32 caliber




now i was wondering whatever he was saying is true or he was just bragging abt his knowledge in front of two laymans as far as caliber and their effective ness in frames and barrel lenth goes.


would be obliged if the gurus shed light on this issue.the only other pistol i came across is llama which houses the .32 &.380 in almost the same frames

Dear Caesar,

With my limited experience, here are some answers to your question :

1. the effective stopping power reduces because the barrel lenth is short.
Ans : Effective stopping power would be determined by the bore and type of ammunition not the barrel length. Eg. an airgun with a 24 inch barrel would have lesser stopping power than a .32 pistol with a 2 inch barrel

2 the range is also reduced greatly because of this factor.
Ans : To a certain extent range is determined by length of barrel. (but not always, it is also determined by the means of propulsion i.e. bullet weight etc..)

3 not very wise to buy a pistol which have the same frames and barrel lenths as in .32 caliber
Ans : I have absolutely no idea what factors the gundealer brings to play with this statement!

Jonah

jonapach has very correctly explained everything. I would like to add the following:

1. the effective stopping power reduces because the barrel lenth is short.

Force = Mass x Acceleration

The force/speed of the bullet is due to the explosive in the cartridge bursting at high velocity and causing acceleration to the bullet. Following points need to be noted:

1) After a certain barrel length(optimum barrel length) when explosive pressure has imparted fullest acceleration to the bullet, the bullet cannot attain more velocity even if extra length of barrel is there.

2) If barrel is very short, then the explosive will not be able to accelerate the bullet to its fullest possible velocity because the pressure of explosive gases will start dissipating into into the air early, even though they have enough energy. This does not mean that bullet coming out of a short barrel is not lethal. .357 magnum bullet coming out of 3 inch barrel will still be carrying more kinetic energy than .32 bullet coming out of 3 inch barrel. Though a .357 magnum bullet coming out of 6 inch barrel will certainly carry more kinetic energy than a .357 magnum bullet coming out of 3 inch barrel.

2 the range is also reduced greatly because of this factor.

Yes the Kinetic Energy is directly proportional to Mass x square of Velocity(E ∝ mv² ). Since the kinetic energy increases with the square of the velocity, an object doubling its speed has four times kinetic energy.

3 not very wise to buy a pistol which have the same frames and barrel lenths as in .32 caliber

Do not try to relate barrel length of one caliber with another. Determine what is the optimum barrel length for .32 separately from determining optimum barrel length for .380 or any other caliber. Generally speaking, for a bullet of given diameter and mass, the more powder in case, the more need of longer barrel.

Thank you friends,
that was very eloborately pointed out and i think i have my answer,just one more thing is bothering me,would u please be kind enough so as to enlighten me on that issue too.
The .380 bullet is bigger \heavier than the .32 bullet so when the barrell lenth is the same for both the calibers ,do u think .380 would travell less than the .32 one hereby reducing the stopping power in distance of the .380 and the one with a longer barrell....the .32 is not in the question here, the question is if the .380 was calibrated in a pistol with a longer barrell not in a frame or a barrell (in lenth) which .32 is adequately i must say is caliberated, wouldnt it make a diff in the range and with it the lethality..i am sorry if i wasnt able to put my question in a manner which could be understood by experts like you.
regards

First of all I would like to say that I am not an "expert".

The .380 bullet is bigger \heavier than the .32 bullet so when the barrell lenth is the same for both the calibers ,do u think .380 would travell less than the .32 one hereby reducing the stopping power in distance of the .380 and the one with a longer barrell

"stopping power" depends on various factors including proper shot placement. Difficult to answer if .380 would travel less distance than .32 because of its weight, but certainly it would be carrying more energy than .32 if it would be traveling at the same velocity.

the question is if the .380 was calibrated in a pistol with a longer barrell not in a frame or a barrell (in lenth) which .32 is adequately i must say is caliberated, wouldnt it make a diff in the range and with it the lethality.

a) If barrel is longer than optimal barrel length for a particular cartridge, it will slow down the bullet. Why? Because the force of propelling pressure of exploded gases in barrel will tend to become less than the friction between bullet and barrel beyond the optimum barrel length.

b) If barrel length is shorter than optimal barrel length for a particular cartridge, the force of propelling pressure of exploded gases in barrel will go waste. A shorter barrel will not be able to contain and channelize the excess gases. Instead you may see a very large muzzle flash when you fire from such gun. How much explosive energy of cartridge will go waste? How much velocity will be lost? It will be determined by how much is the barrel shorter than the optimal length of barrel for that cartridge.

Ideally ballistically optimum barrel length is the best, but practically a trade off is made for the sake of convenience, concealability etc. Since your query basically relates to "ballistics by the inch", you will find the results of actual tests conducted, will be able to compare various calibers, their velocities at various barrel lengths at: http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/results.html

Both the .32 ACP and the .380 are very short, stubby cases. Each will be loaded with fast burning powder by the manufacturers to optimize their loads for the short barreled weapons these cartridges are used in.

Remember, a fast burning powder can offset many of the disadvantages of a short barrel in some instances.

All this said, both the .32 ACP and the .380 are defense rounds. Their optimization is not for accuracy or for highest velocity, but for the best performance in a handy, concealable defensive weapon. That is why they are both short, stubby cases with small powder capacity. They aren't meant for shooting rock chucks over a 400 meter range in a windy canyon!

I very much appreciate Goodboy Mentor's link for "ballistics by the inch" -- this provides some great information. Here are three other sites you can consider that measure penetration of .32 ACP and .380 performance:

http://www.goldenloki.com/ (go to the link "gel tests")
http://www.brassfetcher.com/ (go to the link "handguns")
http://www.handloads.com/misc/stoppingpower.asp (this interesting link provided for us by IFG member SARGE7402)

All this said, in most every weapon (I say most, because you aren't going to find too many long barreled target weapons in either of these calibers), the .380 is going to outperform the .32 ACP. It burns more powder, so it has more energy to transmit to a bullet, for one thing. Secondly, the bullet is larger and heavier. Since both bullets move at about the same speed, the energy available to do damage is apparent.